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Matt_Steele View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_Steele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 03 2013 at 7:59pm
Originally posted by mom4kids mom4kids wrote:

In my job, our sequester effect is seven days spread throughout the remaining fiscal year.  We will end our second quarter March 31.  Seven days of unpaid leave over seven months.  Who really cares.  Its a drop in the bucket.  No one is wringing their hands about their jobs.  

There should be a budget.  There should have been a budget several years ago.  We have been working off a continuing resolutions for more than 3 years.  There has been NO action taken until now.  The politicans have not acted and so now the process will.  Let it go.  Its the most positive action we (taxpayers) have had in three years.

I think 7 days of unpaid leave makes more of a difference than you think for some people, even if it doesn't for you.

Also, for some people it's way more than 7 days of unpaid leave.
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Matt_Steele View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_Steele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 03 2013 at 8:00pm
Originally posted by MFD50 MFD50 wrote:

Originally posted by Matt_Steele Matt_Steele wrote:

Originally posted by MFD50 MFD50 wrote:

The worst part about foreign aid is that it seems like we give them the money today but tomorrow we are their worst enemies. I know it is not a lot compared to the rest of the budget but what is spent sure would help here at home first.


I think that's the common perception but I'm not sure that's actually true. Pakistan yes perhaps, but I'm not sure where else that's true. Especially with our food aid, though we need better marketing. 


We also have to remember the foreign aid is our single best non military way of diplomacy in the world. Talking is just talking, money/food changes things... see Egypt from 1979 til today.
 
We are the government that financed the start of Osama Bin Landen's personal war. We gave him money and weapons to fight the Russians in Afghanistan and then he later turns them on our own people.



Oh absolutely, which is one of the main reasons we're so reluctant to get involved in Syria. I totally understand that. However I think the numbers are against you. We've given a LOT of money to a LOT of different countries without them becoming our enemies later
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mom4kids View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mom4kids Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 07 2013 at 9:57pm
Most people (private sector people) do not receive pay for sick leave and they still manage to call in at least seven times a year.  That is not the case for a federal worker. 

240 hours sick leave (can acquire an unlimited amount which you can take just before retirement in the form of an FMLA - that's right, 100% pay if a doctor will write you a note about anything and say you need the time - even for a family member - and you get to stay at home and use up that time you would otherwise lose.)

240 hours annual leave (this can be earned 4 hours per pay period, 6 hours per pay period or 8 hours per pay period - depending on your length of employment).  Oh, and if you retire and have time available, you get paid for it.  (Although this is the maximum per year - so if you find yourself at the end of the year with excessive days - called use it or lose it - you take the time and are notified that you can take the time.)

Time off Awards - this is in addition to an annual raise.  Up to an additional 40 hours.  Just for being good at your job - which is totally subjective.

How many federal holidays?  10.  And if any of the 10 lands on the weekend, guess what?  If its on a Saturday, you get Friday off.  And if its on a Sunday, you get Monday off.

You're empathy is misplaced.
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Matt_Steele View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_Steele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 08 2013 at 10:21am
Originally posted by mom4kids mom4kids wrote:

Most people (private sector people) do not receive pay for sick leave and they still manage to call in at least seven times a year.  That is not the case for a federal worker. 

240 hours sick leave (can acquire an unlimited amount which you can take just before retirement in the form of an FMLA - that's right, 100% pay if a doctor will write you a note about anything and say you need the time - even for a family member - and you get to stay at home and use up that time you would otherwise lose.)

240 hours annual leave (this can be earned 4 hours per pay period, 6 hours per pay period or 8 hours per pay period - depending on your length of employment).  Oh, and if you retire and have time available, you get paid for it.  (Although this is the maximum per year - so if you find yourself at the end of the year with excessive days - called use it or lose it - you take the time and are notified that you can take the time.)

Time off Awards - this is in addition to an annual raise.  Up to an additional 40 hours.  Just for being good at your job - which is totally subjective.

How many federal holidays?  10.  And if any of the 10 lands on the weekend, guess what?  If its on a Saturday, you get Friday off.  And if its on a Sunday, you get Monday off.

You're empathy is misplaced.

I'm quite familiar with the pay structure of the federal gov't.

You're also forgetting though that they typically get paid a lot less than the private sector, they have a thankless job that is publicly attacked by (mostly) the right wing and they have to follow about 2-3 times the laws and regulations that any private sector employee does using outdated technology because the gov't can't afford to invest because people scream about cutting budgets.

The gov't will only become more inefficient when forced to furlough employees and then not be able to make any capital investments. It might be all fine until you want your social security check in x number of years (or some gov't benefit) and then all of the sudden, the gov't struggles because the technology they're using is pretty outdated.

Anyway, a larger point I'd like to make: Maybe the problem is in the private sector? 

Most countries and nearly all of the developed countries give their employees way more time off than the US. Maybe there's something wrong with the private sector here? 

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mom4kids View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mom4kids Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 10 2013 at 11:23am
Federal employees do not make less than private sector in comparable positions.  Pay scale, annual raises, benefits, time off, and job security benefits far outweigh anything available in the private sector.

And blaming criticism of federal employees on right wingers?  Thankless job?  You are way off.

The government is forced to become more streamlined.  Forced to review business goals in delivering services with less resources.  Nothing but improvement comes from this.  I've seen six sigma principles being applied to archaic work-stream processes, improving efficiency, improving quality, while meeting the needs of the public it serves.

You are just old school.  "We've never done it this way".  "That's not how we do it".  If our leaders stick with the "attrition" tool to lower numbers on the federal employment rolls, you will see an improvement in services provided to our citizens.  You want to echo the message to our elderly that their checks won't come?  Other payouts are going to be stalled or delayed?  The main reason checks are not received historically is because the beneficiary does not update an address change.  All it takes is an address change.  Most people do not realize that a federal notice of any kind does not receive a forwarding address order but is returned to sender when an address change has occurred.  The checks are issued electronically, not manually.

Try again!
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bobpreston View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bobpreston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 10 2013 at 8:49pm
Matt really needs to read more!!!
Federal employees need to take a 30% pay cut and come in line to the private sector.

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org/overpaid-federal-workers
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Matt_Steele View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_Steele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 12 2013 at 11:30am
Originally posted by mom4kids mom4kids wrote:

Federal employees do not make less than private sector in comparable positions.  Pay scale, annual raises, benefits, time off, and job security benefits far outweigh anything available in the private sector.

And blaming criticism of federal employees on right wingers?  Thankless job?  You are way off.

The government is forced to become more streamlined.  Forced to review business goals in delivering services with less resources.  Nothing but improvement comes from this.  I've seen six sigma principles being applied to archaic work-stream processes, improving efficiency, improving quality, while meeting the needs of the public it serves.

You are just old school.  "We've never done it this way".  "That's not how we do it".  If our leaders stick with the "attrition" tool to lower numbers on the federal employment rolls, you will see an improvement in services provided to our citizens.  You want to echo the message to our elderly that their checks won't come?  Other payouts are going to be stalled or delayed?  The main reason checks are not received historically is because the beneficiary does not update an address change.  All it takes is an address change.  Most people do not realize that a federal notice of any kind does not receive a forwarding address order but is returned to sender when an address change has occurred.  The checks are issued electronically, not manually.

Try again!


Ha! That's funny you bring up six sigma, I've been studying for my PMP recently. Interesting take on business process.

I've never been called "old school" before so I'm not sure how to react to that. It sounds like you're accusing me as being afraid of change. Which surprises me and I don't think is consistent with my thoughts.

You've also kind of supported my thought about the gov't using outdated technology. If checks are issued electronically, then they better have the capital investment available for new technology and security. 

I think you're getting into the line of thought that government should be run like a business. Which again, is wrong. The behavior, goals and motivating reasons behind a government is different than a business. Some strategies and philosophies can be implemented within the bureaucracy but the leadership and decision making has to be different.

One final point: I do believe that public workers have been unfairly maligned and I believe more of that criticism has come from people on the conservative side of the ledger. If you want to blame anyone, the Constitution gives Congress most of the power of the government. Including budget, laws and confirmation of cabinet members. 


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Matt_Steele View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt_Steele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 12 2013 at 11:48am
Originally posted by bobpreston bobpreston wrote:

Matt really needs to read more!!!
Federal employees need to take a 30% pay cut and come in line to the private sector.

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org/overpaid-federal-workers


Yes, the average wage for a gov't employee is higher. Then again the government isn't really involved in a lot of jobs on the low end of the pay scale. I read his report and looked at his sources and saw how he tried to adjust for that but I'm not fully convinced. There's a lot of methodological questions there. Perhaps it's my own anecdotal experiences.

That said, I do agree with one of his conclusions. Fixing the static gov't workforce with more turnover. I won't defend the gov't worker blindly, as the fact that there has been little turnover greatly diminished my chances to get into a job that I wanted in the fed gov't a few years ago. I since don't wish to work for the fed gov't (no need to be the enemy anymore than I am on here already lol) but I see that as a big problem going forward.
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